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Moosa’s Musings: This is what’s wrong with Skyrim Smoking
   January 30th, 2012 clock image 12:00 pm

Moosa

I feel like a non-French speaker stumbling into a conference of snobs. The reason for this rests primarily with a game called The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim. Everyone, from Lazygamer’s own Garth Holden to my non-existent children, had been waiting for and then, upon procuring, has loved this game. Big words and loaded descriptions, pumped full of the hot air of gamers’ expectations, took up unnecessary focus in the gaming landscape, like a fat man sitting in front of you at a movie theatre. It looks beautiful; it looks exciting. But, after playing it for some hours, I’m utterly unconvinced that Bethesda has improved on their consistent mistakes.

Similarly, I’m also convinced they’ve pulled off the biggest middle finger to gamers in recent history.

This is not surprising to anyone who has spent considerable time on Bethesda’s previous stupid titles, like Fallout 3 and The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion. Here are some things Bethesda still doesn’t get right.

Human People Faces and Bodies

 

SkyrimFace

The first sign that you’re playing Bethesda game is when, upon encountering a strange amalgam of pixels, which speaks in (usually) a British accent and calls itself a person, you react with: “Argh!”What are you! Kill it with fire!”* Whoever makes character-people-person-human models for Bethesda hasn’t seen a human person since he or she was breastfed. Or perhaps this is how humans look to those who kidnap and tie people up in cling-wrap.

You’ll notice these characters don’t actually have expressions and/or their mouths move but their eyes, eyebrows tend to remain static. The fact it is unnerving we can handle; it’s that the game is trying to be realistic that makes this laughable.

And that’s not good. I don’t want to laugh. I want to be as engaged with the characters as I am with the beautiful environment, weather and fluidity of clouds and sky and rain. The natural world is one of the most immersive environments since Myst. The sound is brilliant and the textures and landscapes, as you move through areas, fill one with awe, wonder and the sensation that you really are there. Drops of water echo throughout cave-systems; grass sways to the thuds of giants’ steps; clouds swirl and mists quiver at one’s feet. Mountain tops really are misty

But then a mannequin, which Bethesda calls a person, comes fumbling through like a one legged ostrich and squawks at you about some missing sword or gem or child. As it does so, its weird stupid features make you wonder which species this is meant to be. This breaks the immersion and all the beauty they worked so hard to create is sucked away into this ugly vacuum called a character model.

This has been a consistent problem since forever for these developers. Just go through the scary montage of faces for Oblivion and Fallout. It’s quite disgusting – actually, disturbing (see Cling wrap Psychopath thesis) – that anyone thought these were passable human faces.

Movement

2

I can’t take a game seriously that deals out this amount of insult to the human species. That’s my job.

Models move as if they’re constantly on flat land, with legs barely recognising height differentiation. This might sound petty, but I assure you it’s not. See, when your character doesn’t react to the land he’s standing on, it’s like the game is pointing a fat finger at the model and saying “LOOK! IT’S A GAME! YOU’RE NOT REALLY THERE, NERD! YOU’RE JUST IN THIS VERY UGLY DUDE’S BODY!”

Not reacting to the land is not reacting to the environment. It throws you out of the experience. Now, obviously you can play Skyrim in 1st-person, but the problem persists for all models. So you might be fighting alongside or amidst a coterie, but you just can’t take any of it seriously when they’re all moonwalking forwards toward your foes.

This too has been a stupid problem, like the previous. Players have expressed how much they enjoy playing in 3rd-person but who wants to do that when it looks like your character is flying through the environment? Who wants to play a game where models barely acknowledge the sloped mountain they’re killing dragons on? And, seriously, fix your stupid “horses” (or, as I call them, steroid moose).

Bugs

 

6

Yeah, screw you, Bethesda. I’m both intrigued and angered by the common reply of “Oh well, it is Bethesda. You should expect it to be buggy.” I expect humans to do stupid things all the time; I expect us to make laws banning research into areas that promise the most in terms of medical science; I expect humans to literally kill each other over what happens in games. I also expect every game to not work on my PC and on my PS3, since no game is perfect

But there’s a difference between expecting and accepting. See, what people are saying when they claim we should “expect” Bethesda games to be buggy is that we should just “accept” it. I’m sorry: When did we start accepting half-made items that we pay full-price for? Since when, as consumers, did we stop saying “I’m giving you all of this money for the entire package, as you claim it to be”? It is unacceptable that Bethesda consistently releases DVD-shaped poop and hope you don’t notice the smell.

This, like the character models, has still not been improved on.

Variation

Grey, dull, lifeless. No, I’m not describing Mitt Romney but the textures and colour variations used in Bethesda’s games, from Oblivion to Fallout 3 (especially Fallout 3). They’ve actually improved a lot in Skyrim, so this is a less critical point. However, this is about variation which Bethesda uses up on their brilliance of sound textures, music, and, mostly, landscape details.

Towns look similar. Character models look and sound similar. Speech and dialogue lines from NPCs are all the same, even so far as using the same voice actor (despite an impressive number of voice actors credited – about 70 I believe): merchants talking about how great their wares are, herbalists wanting to pull the quackery we see in today’s world by diagnosing you with ailments that don’t exist (detox anyone?). Towns are too similar in design and structure. And, of course, the old carrot of clichéd plotlines which I’ve beaten you with my own stick before..

Go there, fetch this, solve puzzle, come back, fetch this. Rinse, gargle (also known as “Bethesda dialogue”), repeat.

It’s a big map (understatement). But, as all the women I sleep with know, bigger is not necessarily better. Yet, as with many sandbox games, we are deceived into thinking a stupid fetch quest is “epic”, when in fact it just took so damn long to get there.

An example of a game that minimises distance, somewhat, but gives you immersive and truly epic quests is Deus Ex: Human Revolution (probably the best game to come out recently, in my opinion). For example, I was told to get money back from a woman who hadn’t been paying her bills to this dodgy bar. I go through and discover there’s another side to the story: she claims to being extorted. Now you have two or three choices in how to proceed. Kill her, intimidate her, go on her side, confront bar, etc. It’s a simple quest, but the complexity that arises out of it is not only unexpected but treats you like a moral adult. Fetching a sword from the other side of the world so you can have some sexy time with it is hardly worth 3 hours of my life.

Combat

Skyrimdragon

Skyrim has the same combat mechanism as that other overrated, repetitive nonsense Diablo: click-click-click x 1,000. At least Diablo has many other things going for it, like being fun and having a bitching storyline and mythology. In Skyrim, swords, like characters’ feet, don’t really interact with what they come into contact with. You just kind of hack in someone’s general direction until they fall down. We’re not expecting the brilliance of Condemned’s melee combat, but at least physics could’ve woken up even a little to say something about the meeting of two objects in the world: say a sword and some flesh. Instead, characters just seem to fall down after awhile and react like empty bags of skin to the ground.

Also, characters are terrible at blocking and the slo-mo super death thing just doesn’t look that great (Dragon Age: Origins probably has some of the best I’ve ever seen).

Combat is a nasty affair in Skyrim, as it was in Fallout and Oblivion, and not in the way the developers intended.

Story

3

Ah, my old favourite criticism point. It seems that few companies know how to make a good story. F3AR, for example, is different because they got not one, but two, great horror writers to produce their story: John Carpenter (The Thing) and Steven Niles (30 Days of Night, original comic series and later cool movie). I’m not sure who wrote or did the plotting for Skyrim, but the story does not flow, it’s mostly meaningless and is not very exciting.

And, as game writer Nicole Tanner highlights, even if you enjoyed the main quest, there’s little reward or acknowledgement that you’ve done anything so grand as complete the main quest in Skyrim itself. Life continues as if nothing really happened. Real life should continue as if you’ve done nothing but sit on your arse for hours, but the least the digital world could do something: a castle? A book? Groupies?

The game essentially says: “So what if you saved the world? You still need to pay rent, take the trash out and walk the dog, big man.” Yeah, well, most of us get that regardless of whether we’ve saved a gaming world. The point of a gaming world is to obtain some kind of grand reward to match up to the grand conflict we resolved. This is the ultimate case of blue-balls, but worse, it’s a major failing when a game doesn’t recognise or react properly to your incredible achievements. We’re creatures spurned on by incentives: otherwise, why the hell should we do anything you say, Max von Sydow?

Praises, Solutions and Conclusion

5

I’ve already highlighted what Skyrim gets right: some beautiful graphics, immersion, sound and the ability to suck you in (as long as there’s no moving character models). I’m greatly impressed they’ve increased their voice-actors to number more than three (despite it feeling like they’re only three, but I’ve pointed out the problem with variation above).

And their implementation of dual-wielding is fantastic, despite my reservations of the combat. That one can wield magic, while swinging a sword, is brilliant, as well as doubling the power of the spell if its dual-wielded. Now we just need to actually “feel” like the blade is penetrating flesh.

Though the skills tree is quite silly to use (just try getting to a specific spot on the PS3), it does look elegant and the sounds and little notes are quite charming. The Witcher 2 did a better job and a mixture of the both games would probably be better.

Character models still look and act really stupid. It’s bizarre to me that today we’re still having this problem; it’s more bizarre when you think of what Bethesda achieves in every area except their character models: whose faces look like Satan’s estranged haemorrhoids and who consistently ignore the laws of physics. You can make our hearts fill with wonder with golden dawns, rain on long grass, shadowed caves, and creaking trees, but you can’t make Farmer Joe look like he’s walking properly back home to sleep with his wife-daughter-sister (same person)? For shame.

And the story? Really? I’m not an accomplished story-teller, though I’ve written some fiction in my life that people have appreciated, so I kind of know how to create, and what constitutes competent stories. Stop hiring people who either don’t know or can’t help you execute your games. Sure, finding out why the dragons are back sounds cool but its not entirely original or that exciting. If you’re going to use dragons, why make them one dimensional? Why can’t we ride one or be friends with one? Why not make missions where you have to defend towns, by helping them fortify the town, setting up positions for defence, etc.? Blah, blah. You get it. These aren’t great ideas but they are certainly more interesting than most of what occurs in Skyrim, for me. At least these kinds of options should be there to add something more to the game in relation to the quite banal idea of dragon attacks.

Indeed, games companies should have more open engagement with their fans to create stories: for example, have short-story competitions for quests and get gamers to write it. Give them a free copy of the game as a reward, since you’ll have your most important element down – a love of the game and knowledge of it. And, you’re giving them a product which the gamer contributed to. I’m not sure why games companies don’t use the passion of the gamers to create games, too: There is so much untapped talent out there (I don’t just mean on Friday nights in underage clubs), and so much of it driven just by raw passion for games, everybody wins if games companies actually enlisted the help of those they create the games for (just consider Naughty Dog and their response to gamers’ issues with aiming in Unchartered 3). Sure there’s dangers of exploitation but that’s a given in any area. Anyway, that’s just my last thoughts on this where I think most games – not just Skyrim – could’ve benefitted.

Considering this game got a perfect ten, like your sister, on many websites (including this one) I’m sure there will be a few disagreements. Don’t worry. Unlike Bethesda Pacifists, I’m not “expecting” anyone to support me.

* The way some people reacted to this horrible monstrosity.

** Haha.

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Editorial | Features | PC Gaming | PS3 | RPG | x24 | Xbox 360
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  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_JI422YSUYHEEX2FJPHJZPXX5IQ Syth Za

    I support you!

    Good arguments. The game as a whole os good but when you start disecting several aspects and compare it to what they’ve been offering us forever now, it all starts falling apart.

    Still a good game, but no where near what it rated.

    • http://twitter.com/tauriqmoosa Tauriq Moosa

      Thank you, good sir! I just need a bottle of Bells to share.

  • http://twitter.com/JimLenoir James Lenoir

    I think I love you… (no homo). While, my opinion on Skyrim is a lot stronger than yours you absolutely nailed it. Thank you Mr Taurig, I support you! 

    • http://twitter.com/tauriqmoosa Tauriq Moosa

      If there is going to be non-homo love directed at me, at least spell my name correctly, man! But seriously, thank you very much. I’m very glad I got the Lenoir Bump.

      • http://twitter.com/JimLenoir James Lenoir

        Dude, I’m not wearing my glasses, qs and gs look the same to me.

  • Jay

    Have you actually played the game? I’m not convinced. Seems like you’re reviewing Oblivion, here, not Skyrim.

    • http://twitter.com/tauriqmoosa Tauriq Moosa

      No. I haven’t actually played it. Neither have any of the other people supporting my arguments on this thread. It’s a giant, evil, Freemason, Dan Brown conspiracy against you!

      • http://twitter.com/JimLenoir James Lenoir

        HAHAHAHAAH!  This is the funniest retort I’ve ever read.

  • http://www.twitter.com/WobblyOnion Geoffrey Tim

    I hold a flag of support! I loved the game, even nominated it as GOTY – but it’s something I wish I could rescind. After I got beyond 60 hours, it really became a shallow, hollow experience. After the initial wave of magic passed, the holes started showing.

    I think gamers got duped. 

    • http://twitter.com/tauriqmoosa Tauriq Moosa

      Yeah, precisely my point. You might as well use this comment as the td;lr of my post.

    • http://twitter.com/JimLenoir James Lenoir

      Oblivion had the same problems, and I remember the wails and cries when gamers finally realised that even though they were the Arch Mage-Thief Guild Leader-Top Blades-Mega Assassin, their input in the world was still negligible. NPC still referred to them by the same derisive tones as when they had started the game, and in fact the RPG side of Oblivion was a ruse. The truth is it doesn’t matter what you do in the game. It’s as shallow and hollow as a badly-made JRPG.

      Skyrim is much the same, and in many respects it’s actually worse than Oblivion. Not my favourite RPG, but still not the worst. Dragon Effect One Cave still has that title.

      I think even without the bugs I experienced on both sides of PS3 and xbox 360, I would have still ended up hating Skyrim’s guts. My only shame is that I forgot how much Oblivion sucked. In that sense, Bethesda pulled the wool over my eyes again.

    • Koko

      Yes. Skyrim has a lot of issues. And I agree with several of Mr Moosa’s musings.

      But are you seriously saying that 60 hours of gameplay wasn’t your money’s worth? (or was it in sarcasm font?) How many games can you name, except for multiplayer components, that could last that long? Yes, most of the quests are repetitive, but playing a MW3 or SC II map over and over isn’t repetitive?

      I only played just over 30 hours of Skyrim before it became “repetitive” to me, but I still feel that it was worth every cent. And every now and then when I get hungry for some dragon souls, I know there’s a shout somewhere that I haven’t learnt yet.

      • http://www.twitter.com/WobblyOnion Geoffrey Tim

        I didn’t say cheated; I said duped – which means deceived. 

        I loved the game, and it was certainly worth the money – but it wasn’t everything it was sold to be – with its radiant AI, and procedurally generated quests that were never meant to get repeated, and its much better human physics, and its more expansive voice recording. 

    • Markdoubleu

      I’m with Koko here…

      You feel cheated because the experience paled after 60 hours? So, on the outside, R10/h?

      Yup, I can see how you got cheated there…

    • 14Deadsouls

      Although you did get 60 hours of magic from it? Isn’t that WAY more than most other games today, especially single player ones.

  • Henk Roux

    Nice. A little ranty, but a spot-on write-up.

    • http://twitter.com/tauriqmoosa Tauriq Moosa

      A “little”? Understatement.

      You’re too kind, Mr Roux. Share a Bells?

      • Henk Roux

        Naturally :)

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=637870587 Pete Oosthuizen

    The witcher 2 was a better game.

    • http://twitter.com/tauriqmoosa Tauriq Moosa

      Wish I could play it but my PC is too crap.

  • Eben Puth

    Agree 100%.  I started playing the game,  enjoyed it a lot,  for the first 3 hours…

    After that I got bored of doing the exact same thing every quest.  Talk to some guy,  travel a gazillion miles to a cave,  go in and kill everything that moves,  get the ring/book/staff/sword and go back to the guy that gave you the quest.  Rinse, repeat.   

  • http://twitter.com/rainynight65 Alex Hempel

    The problem with any Elder Scrolls game so far is that the world happens in a 10m bubble around you. I have yet to see anything I do in one of these games have a meaningful impact on the game world. That’s not to say that they are necessarily bad games. I enjoyed the time I spent with Morrowind, Oblivion and Skyrim, but I have yet to see any of these games all the way through to the end of the main story.

    • http://twitter.com/tauriqmoosa Tauriq Moosa

      Great description of the 10m bubble.

  • Musesurf

    I agree with you about the combat system.  After playing games like Demon’s/Dark Souls the combat system of the Elder Scrolls games feel pathetic.  
    At least with Fallout we had VATS which was awesome.  Perhaps someone could create a VATS mod for Skyrim?

  • Purple Dragon

    First time I’ve seen someone admitting to having a small cock on the internet to a multitude of readers. Haha.

    But seriously I agree with your comments. Bit long so glossed over some of it. I still don’t understand why this game got a 10 out of 10. I don’t agree with “oh it’s such a big game”, “you have to expect bugs from Bethesda”.

    Really? It’s like you commission someone to build you a massive mansion for $100 million. They go away and they work on it and finish it. They tell you it is complete and that you must come fetch the keys and look at it. You go and you check it out and wow it looks great and everything is dandy. Over the next week or two you find that some cupboards don’t close properly, the toilet is not working in the 2nd guest room etc. So you phone up your building guy and say fuck man you haven’t done it properly, there are still problems. “Oh man, it’s such a BIG house, it has to be expected”. Yeah right. Bit of a grandiose example but you get my point. A plane is so huge, but it’s ok if we miss out a faulty rivot somwhere because “it’s so big”.

    If you want to build big shit you better make sure you have all your bases covered. Have a bigger testing team (although I have to wonder what their current test team does) and proper planning, proper management. I wonder if anyone actually ever tested the game for more than 60 hours on the PS3. Plan for these kind of problems, you can’t just sit behind the “it’s so big” excuse. If you can’t do it then don’t be in the business of making big games.

    But no, it’s fucking lekker having a big game with lots of bugs. Oh wow, no problem that Bethesda is screwing you by charging you full price for a game that you are beta testing. Oh it’s fine, we love you Bethesda and basically falling over to suck them off and hand out 10 out 10s. And you wonder why they keep releasing buggy games? Fuck, their gamers deserve it.I was very keen on getting Skyrim but I decided against it when I first started hearing about all the problems, particularly the PS3 lag issue. As a general rule I will not buy a game that is buggy on release and/or has a day 1 patch and/or DLC. But I was willing to bend that rule as it sounded so good. What killed it for me was Bethesda’s response to the PS3 lag issue. It was like they didn’t consider it a problem or important and their response was basically fuck you PS3 owners, we don’t give a shit about you and you will just have to wait. Fuck, if it was my company I would be rushing to get it sorted and spending major manhours on this. I would also have had better PR than that.So yeah, I won’t be getting Skyrim. I’d rather wait for Kingdoms of Amalur, which hopefully won’t have the same kind of problems as Skyrim does.

    • http://twitter.com/tauriqmoosa Tauriq Moosa

      “First time I’ve seen someone admitting to having a small cock on the internet to a multitude of readers.”

      That’s one interpretation. The other is that I don’t but am using it incorrectly. Or rather that there are no women. Um… I’ll just put this spade down now.

    • http://twitter.com/rainynight65 Alex Hempel

      ” As a general rule I will not buy a game that is buggy on release and/or has a day 1 patch and/or DLC”So tell me, which games have you bought as of late? These days the day-1 patch seems to be an early-leak protection as much as a last minute fix…

  • Anon A Mouse

    I can’t say if I agree or disagree, since i haven’t played the game yet. But a lot of what you mention is what I’ve hated about Oblivion and the reason I’ve declined getting Skyrim although all the hype around it drew me in. I even had the game in hand until I got to the checkout and decided against it. I finally feel validated about that decision.

  • Kai

    Hmm.. what a shame. I’m really enjoying Skyrim, having being disappointed with Oblivion.
    To me, Skyrim takes a lot of the aspects of Morrowind that kept me enthralled for weeks, and revitalises them with a fresh look, new engine and deep and immersive plot-lines.

    To say that the story meaningless and unexciting leads me to believe you’re expecting too much. Whether’s it’s meaningless or not is somewhat irrelevant – do you really look for meaning in the fantasy RPG genre? The story could be more exciting, certainly.. better use of triggered events to coincide with decent dialogue, would be a good start.. perhaps more of the staged events of the opening scenes? i.e. more dragon involvement whereby the world is torn apart and changed permanently as a result. Towns attacked by the dragons should be left smouldering – and this should happen throughout the game, allowing for defense attempts to be mounted. If successful, then elements of the towns infrastructure remain. Would add a little more excitement, and said attacks would be integral to the story, if used in context correctly.

    All in all, I’m happy with Skyrim. It’s an obvious statement, but you can’t develop a game that is all things to all men. And as a matter of fact, I adored Diablo… I played it to death when it was released and snapped up D2 and the LoD expansion when they arrived. I’m going to buy D3 when it’s out – but even as a massive fan of the Blizzard hack’n'slash dungeon-devlers, I can still see aspects of Elder Scrolls games that eclipse the enormity of any Diablo release.

  • http://www.facebook.com/eben.snyman Eben Snyman

    The drudgery has set in.Not even the dragons could save this game for me.I feel sullied.

  • Anonymous

    I’m finding it kind of surprising that people are complaining about the game 3 months down the line. The way everybody was going on about Skyrim, I would never have guessed people would rant about the GOTY so quickly.

    • http://twitter.com/tauriqmoosa Tauriq Moosa

      Well it takes forever to play the damned thing.

  • Ghost in the Machine

    It’s not hard to find fault with a game like Skyrim, or Oblivion, or any of the Fallout genre, ‘repetitive’ is a given when a game mirrors any aspect of life – LIFE is repetitive. Earn some gold, find some treasure, sell it, upgrade your gear rinse repeat. Sounds boring but in fact is what the game is all about.

    Bugs, well I haven’t yet played a PS3 game that was bug free, Bethesda is no worse than anyone else writing for the platform.

    Storyline – well if you don’t like D&D storylines why are you playing the game? It can’t have come as a shock that this was yet another Magic/Dragon/Sword and Sorcery romp? So you didn’t feel ‘thanked’ enough for defeating the bad guy? Maybe you have self validation issues. For me, playing the game isn’t all about the end screen.

    Combat mode – isn’t the whole point of RPG’s that you DON’t have to be lighting on the joystick to play them? First peron shooters give you that, RPG’s are more sit back and think about it, which IMHO is a strength.

    So while I accept some of your cirtiticisms are valid, they are not unique to Skyrim, or even Bethesda. And for me, Skyrim is a great game with literally hundreds of hours of enjoyment to be had, well worth the cost any day.

    I did enjoy Dragon Age a bit more though, but that was mainly for Morigans body.
    :-)

    • http://twitter.com/tauriqmoosa Tauriq Moosa

      To claim that life is repetitive is a weird statement when the point of games is to elicit awe, wonder and creativity that is sometimes missing from everyday life. Otherwise why play games if they’re just going to put you into a cubicle from which you’ve just clocked out of?

      I find your notion that Skyrim is no more buggy than other games ridiculous. The point is the bugs make the game unplayable, not that the bugs are “just” there. If you don’t get that, simply consult the numerous complaints and Bethesda reaction to PS3 lagging. It’s disgusting that this issue came through in the final version. Also, the bugs aren’t merely charming or dismissive: they make the game either unplayable, as I’ve said (framerate basically makes the game a series of JPGs), or stupid (horses shooting up into the air like they have rockets in their feet).

      The retort that if I don’t like something, why not try something else is not going to work here (storywise). I said where they could either improve on or better implement the story. There are plenty of amazing fantasty stories – like  Erikson’s Malazan series. It just requires some thought behind it or getting people who actually care about stories involved, instead of using quite boring cliches. Also, they use cliche plot-devices (which is not the same as stories). Furthermore, it’s not about being “thanked”, its about the game actually reacting to your actions. For example, I would take a thank you or the whole world out hunting me for betraying them as a welcome response. Instead there’s simply cold silence and the game world doesn’t react at all to your actions. Whatever issues I have are irrelevant to the fact that the game doesn’t respond to your existence or actions (otherwise, it might as well be a game where you just walk around looking at pretty things). See Alex Hempel’s comment about the 10m bubble.

      > Combat mode – isn’t the whole point of RPG’s that you DON’t have to be
      lighting on the joystick to play them? First peron shooters give you
      that, RPG’s are more sit back and think about it, which IMHO is a
      strength.This is completely meaningless to me. I don’t know how this counters or even engages with what I said about the combat in Skyrim. There is no thinking involved, as far as I could see, in Skyrim combat. BTW: Diablo was hardly “sit back and think about it”. > So while I accept some of your cirtiticisms are valid, they are not
      unique to Skyrim, or even Bethesda. And for me, Skyrim is a great game
      with literally hundreds of hours of enjoyment to be had, well worth the
      cost any day.Then we’re playing different studios. Your the first person I’ve read online who doesn’t think there’s anything unique about Bethesda’s bugginess and stupid games. Even those who adore Skyrim have admitted the bugs, so this is particularly strange.

  • http://twitter.com/highwaymanza freddie van eyk

    Main storyline completed after 20 or so hours , i don’t really feel like going back to Skyrim , but Dark Souls i’m still going back after 95 hours , that is the difference to me.

  • http://twitter.com/AlwynVenter317 Alwyn Venter

    Nice article Tauriq. After discussing this with many people and getting feedback from my mates, I finally succumbed and got hold of a copy of the game. I played about 40 hours and then just decided that’s it. I can’t do this anymore. It started feeling like World of Warcraft all over again (which probably links in with your article about game plot lines). 
    I strongly feel that developers should start thinking of how to make games great again. In one of your previous posts I mention that they (developers) just skin games to have better graphics, more guns etc. rather than focus on the core – what makes the game fun to play. Anyway, good article.

    • http://twitter.com/tauriqmoosa Tauriq Moosa

      Cheers and agreed. I’m going to be writing about that problem of sacrificing what makes games good for graphics (etc.) next week.

  • Anonymous

    What we have here is a case of cognitive dissonance.

    Skyrim delivers this gorgeous, immersive physical world that’s visually better than its predecessors.  Though there is some re-use of components, the dungeons are well-enough hand-crafted that each seems unique.  The world feels real; the player wants to see what’s behind every rock.

    (And contrary to the author’s claim, I think Skyrim is much, much less buggy than Oblivion was two months after its release.  Or even years after its release.)

    But then you’ve got poor character modeling.  A plethora of fetch-it or kill-it quests without much original thinking behind many of them.  No improvement in combat physics.  By far the worst deficit of all, the non-player characters (NPCs) are wooden and unresponsive except in narrowly programmed ways.  With respect to the NPCs, there’s no “there” there: you’re alone in a world of dummies.

    It’s not that other games do a better job of making NPCs seem real (though some do a better job of making them *look* real, they still act like wooden dummies).  It’s that Skyrim as a world we experience looks and feels so real, wooden NPCs make our teeth hurt.  That’s cognitive dissonance for you.

    There’s almost no reaction from NPCs to the progress of world events.  You can’t talk to them about what interests you, you can only talk to the very, very few subjects they’re preprogrammed to talk about.  There’s no artificial intelligence (AI).  Nothing happens outside of the 10 meter bubble; you’re the only actor moving the plots forward.

    Nobody expects AI in gauntlet-style games where it’s all about aim-shoot trigger reflexes.  It’s only when immersion in a gorgeous sandbox world is so successful that it becomes important.

    Unfortunately, nobody has any idea of how to add AI to NPCs.  Tweaking models and animation, writing better stories, better combat physics, those are all problems that could, at least in theory, be addressed with current software technology and methods.  But making NPCs feel real in an immersive world is a different sort of challenge, and one which BethSoft probably does not have the resources to tackle.

    The better sandbox worlds become, the more this deficit will glare.  Cognitive dissonance will undercut the value of those sandbox worlds.

    The company that makes NPCs come alive – able to beat Alan Turing’s test, or almost beat it – is going to revolutionize RPGs.

    I don’t have all the answers, but I do have a modest proposal.  Google has to be nervous about Siri, right?  Apple stole a march on the industry there, and is racing to improve their lead.  That’s interesting for a couple of reasons: the motivation it might give to Google to invest in AI research is one.  But the other reason it’s interesting is that Apple didn’t try to box Siri into its consumer products.  Siri exists on the internet and draws on the power of distant servers.

    That’s a dynamic no game company has toyed with, far as I know.  But it’s a natural.  Why lard up a single PC or game console with AI routines, when you can stick them in the cloud and do so much more with them?  Yes, you’d have to keep your PC connected to play, but the reward – NPCs coming alive – would be worth it.

    Google could make that happen, I think, if they had a motive.  They could design AI algorithms and templates, then offer them to game companies to drive their NPCs from the cloud.  I don’t want to trivialize the difficulty of the challenge, but if Google can make autonomous vehicles, and if they’re already interested in cloud-based AI for their tablets, phones and everything else they’re doing, they can probably sort out AIs for NPCs.  The main question is, what’s the business case?  How could Google profit from millions of gamers enjoying better, more immersive games?

    I don’t think cluttering virtual game worlds’ landscapes with real-world advertising billboards will fly.  Nor will gamers appreciate commercials taking away from play time.

    So, there’s an idea left unfulfilled.  For the foreseeable future, the better sandbox worlds get, the worse will be the cognitive dissonance gamers experience in them.

    • Anonymous

      Haha, imagine picking up a used can of coke in the province of Skyrim. Immersion = Gone!

    • http://twitter.com/tauriqmoosa Tauriq Moosa

      Like your point that the NPCs became more obvious due to the beauty and brilliance of the world they are in. I don’t think I claimed that Skyrim
      was more or less buggy than Oblivion – but that it was, like its
      predecessors, buggy upon release.

      BTW: I think cognitive dissonance deals more with the ability to and discomfort of hold two contrary views at the same time. What your talking of seems more like stark contrast: the characters standout as being flat because of how incredible the land and world is.

      For more on CD: http://psychology.about.com/od/cognitivepsychology/f/dissonance.htm

      • Anonymous

        Cognitive dissonance is exactly what I intended to say about Skyrim.  On the one hand, the world invites us to immerse ourselves in an alternate reality, a beautiful world simulation more than a game; it raises our expectations.  And then we have these wooden NPCs who fail to add the human dimension that we expect to find in a real-like world.  That’s two contrary experiences – not merely contrasting observations.  Our minds get whacked with contradicting sensory and cognitive input.  Our expectations are pulled in different directions.  Do we take this alternate reality seriously?  Our minds uncomfortably oscillate back and forth on this question.  The better the sandbox, the worse the cognitive dissonance of wooden NPCs.

        Wooden NPCs aren’t the only source of cognitive dissonance.  Skyrim is a world…

          -  With two moons but no tides.

          -  With snow, but never accumulation or melting.

          -  With months and seasons (according to lore), but no seasonal changes to any particular location.

          -  Where the connection between latitude and climate is inconsistent, and I’m not just talking about the area affected by active vulcanism and hot springs near Markarth and Kynesgrove, where arguably it’s justified.

          -  Where waving your sword generally in the direction of an enemy makes him fall down (as you correctly pointed out).

          -  Where model animations (as you also pointed out) fail to respond appropriately to stairs and slopes.

        But for me, the limitations of NPC behaviors and conversations are the big sticking point.  In a world that looks this good, I want to respond to it as though it were real, in a fantasy sort of way.  The NPCs dash my hopes.  It’s like playing in a huge storefront with animatronic mannequins, not a virtual world.  People are spontaneous and complex; NPCs, not.

        With gauntlet games, we’re so busy getting through choke points and tied-to-the-rails plots that we hardly have time to think about NPCs.  It’s only in sandboxes that the cognitive dissonance becomes large.

        I love sandboxes.  I just wish that as BethSoft pushes sandboxing to new heights – and make no mistake, with Skyrim, they have – NPCs were coming as alive as the world models.

        • Anonymous

          Play Stalker, if you want NPC’s with actual life to them.  GSC seriously put time into the AI that each NPC employed.  To such a degree that it had to be dialed back, because NPC’s were conquering the game by themselves.

  • http://twitter.com/eXCheez Gareth Lagesse

    This article should’ve simply been a picture of Todd Howard.

  • Grimstone

    Man, i feel very alone.  I love this game, love it to bits.  I mean, how much can someone fit in to 6GB.  This is an entire world here (well, a country), so i anticipated a few sacrifices to achieve this.  The games you’re comparing this to simply don’t contain this level of content, and as such, can invest some code in to the ‘realism’ areas of surface to surface interactions, movements, and the characters (although i think they’re fine).  I also love the open-endedness.  I played Oblivion for over a year and a half.  I’m a casual gamer, but i like hunting down all the little bits at my leisure.  I avoid mods too as I’m really after what the game designers have on offer, not what everyone else thinks should be there.  I would have included ‘specs’ however (to make unique outfits/armours from perked materials), but that’s it.  Perhaps I just don’t expect as much as other players.  For me, its the closest thing to what i’m looking for in a game.  :s

    • http://twitter.com/tauriqmoosa Tauriq Moosa

      I’m glad you enjoyed it. And it’s true: I expect more of what I get from solid novels and comics from games, than perhaps others. I expect to be invested in the world and, especially, the characters and the story. This I didn’t feel happened in Skyrim.

    • Chris

      I’m with you on this. I love having to fire up my Xbox and finish one quest, then another one the next day. It’s like reading a book to me. Everyone’s entitled to their own opinion I guess.

      • Grimstone

        Over ten million people would agree…  ;)

        • http://twitter.com/tauriqmoosa Tauriq Moosa

          Yes, but just like telling a lie a thousand times doesn’t make it true, neither does holding popular view (just because it’s popular) make it the right view. I don’t deny people enjoyed it but my criticisms remain and I don’t think any disagrees that these are valid criticisms. This doesn’t mean I think no one should be playing it, only that there are good (or rather “bad” reasons, heh) not to.

          • Grimstone

            I admire your dedication in responding to these posts.  Kudos to ya.  And I certainly agree with you when you say “just because a majority agree, don’t make it right” angle.  I guess I was being I little bit of a smug twig and having a sly dig.  My apologies for that.
             
            Having said that, I still haven’t had anything happen to spoil the experience.  That’s not to say stuff don’t go wrong.  Last night I got the “seek out the red sword” something or other.  It’s a quest I got from a book, completed and disenchanted/sold off the one and two handed swords, and then, reading that book again has reissued the mission.  I assumed I could not complete it twice, so I restored from a previous save.  Now there are people that would really throw a wobbler at that, but geesh, this was a huge project and it’ll take some time to iron out the creases.  This game is a developer’s nightmare, and all things considered, a damn fine effort by all accounts.
             
            I remember comparing the combat from Dark Messiah against Oblivion and thinking at that time, “man, Oblivion is really lacking here.”  But it retrospect, I couldn’t do what the hell I wanted in Dark Messiah.  I was tied down to a specific set of paths.  The developers knew exactly what I was going to do and this provides an excellent canvas for testing and weaning out the bugs.  The Elder Scrolls games do not follow that set path.  They don’t follow any path.  I mean, what tester would ever think to stick a bucket over a shop keepers head and rob him.  I mean, what ‘true’ role player would ever do that anyway.  You’d have to accept you’re not role playing and that you are simply playing a game in which such absurd actions have some benefits.  I certainly wouldn’t dream of doing that, because that would ruin my immersion.

  • Anonymous

    Here is my 2 cents. I really wanted to play this game. All the hype before hand and so on. I was lucky that I decided to wait before I buy it for the PS3, which is my only form of gaming. Everybody went nuts for the game. But then the reports of bugs and “Game-breaking issues” started coming through.

    Basically what it boils down to is that I will never play this game. Even when the (undeserved title) GOTY Edition gets released. Simple reason… Bethesda gave us an unfinished or unpolished product. Something that could have costed me R500 to buy, and then I’m not even talking about bandwidth used to download all the worthless patches. We all know what bandwidth costs in this country.

    What it boils down to is that I would have paid so much more for a game that I’m not even sure is fixed now, almost 3 months down the line. I’m lucky, I have internet, what about those people in our country who don’t have their consoles permanently connected? It might sound funny to some, but I’m pretty sure that there is more of those people than we think.

    I cannot comment on gameplay issues I haven’t played the game so talking about combat and repetitive quests on wooden NPCs is out for me. I’m sure that those who find it boring is right, and I’m pretty sure those who enjoy the game is right as well. We are all entitled to our opinions.

    I’m just ranting about the fact that the game got all this praise yet a large chunk of the gameplaying community got screwed by Bethesda.

    Stop giving Skyrim all this praise, next time you might be the one you gets fucked by Bethesda, or any other developer out there.

  • Chaosritter

    Wow, and people wanted to rip my face off when I complained about the same things when the game came out…

  • 14Deadsouls

    I get really annoyed when people complain about skyrim combat. All these RPG’s with crazy characters that fly around shooting fireballs from their eyes and bolts of lightning from their ass while spinning around with a sword 15X their size really isn’t that appealling to me. The thing I like about Skyrim’s melee Combat, and all Elder Scrolls melee was that it didn’t feel fancy, it actually felt like an actual human being swinging a sword. The fact that I could pull out of a fight and run the hell away or raise my sheild only to have it bashed out of my hands OR to have to stab a troll in the neck 15 times before it finally went down is what added the perfect immersion in terms of combat for me.

    And people constantly bring up Dark Souls in Skyrim debates… they’re such different styles of RPG I don’t know why they would try to compare; because of the combat? PLEASE. Sure Dark Souls may look better, but it’s bloody fustrating to control if you pressed that button one time to many and your character does some retarded slash in mid air only to be cut down by a side-stepping skeleton. Sure you could pull off all these fancy moves, but all anyone ever does or trys to do is run around the enemy and stab them in the butt 20 times until they finally resign to diahorre- Err I mean death. Dark Souls is a Brill game, but please don’t use it as an excuse to slag off Skyrim.

    I’m not saying I don’t like flashy fighting game, Devil May Cry is one of my all time favourite franchises, as is Ninja Gaiden, but Skyrim for me fills the gap were a simple, brutal, awkward and desperate bash to the head with a mace will suffice.

    • http://twitter.com/tauriqmoosa Tauriq Moosa

      If you’ve played Condemned then you’ll know what constitutes good melee combat. Even Dead Island had better since you “felt” your weapons make contact with the object in question. I agree that its a nice, desperate, run-away if necessary type combat, but considering lesser games like Condemned got the actual combat itself better, this is unforgivable.

      You’re one of the first people that’s praised the melee combat as feeling real; I was working on the assumption that many people shared the view I had. No worries: if you like the combat, good for you. I think its atrocious and insulting.

  • http://twitter.com/Valshen Garth Holden

    Cool, is this going to become a regular feature? “Three months ago we reviewed XYZ. We were wrong! Don’t listen to us, life is an illusion, mmmm, cake.”

    • Anonymous

      Actually not a bad idea to look at games down the line. How does people feel about the game after a couple of months. Especially if it is such a big release as Skyrim. There are games as well. Like Batman, Arkam City, Deus Ex, Assassin’s Creed etc. Was it worth all the hype and praise.

      Could be fun.

      We should just be mindful of spoilers.

      • Wtf?

        Yeah!  Let’s do that.  Let’s leave the backdoor open so we can run away when  the sh!t hits the fan.
        Please.  If the comments from the lazygamer staff are to be believed, there is no way in hell I will trust  a review posted by any of these guys.  WHy?  A bloody review should tell you what is the bad parts of a game as well as the good.  Not, oh wait.  Lets see what Lazygamer says 3 months after release.  Should a reviewer worth his salt not be able to tell you in their first review that hang on, this is a great game, but be wary that quests may seem repetitive, combat is not as “real” as Condemned and so on?
        There is just no way any reviewer should go back on a review.  And any bloody publication, whether printed or web based that allows for this should be ignored…

        • http://twitter.com/tauriqmoosa Tauriq Moosa

          I agree that it might be worrying if reviewers aren’t able to pick up on problems in the beginning, but you have to allow for the fact that some games – like Skyrim – can’t be “completed” in a reasonable amount of time. Furthermore, as Kotaku pointed out recently with their change in reviewing, working to a deadline often results in unnecessarily negative reviews. It might take a while to get into it (maybe an extra month, not necessarily three).

          Furthermore, there will probably be very few games where reviewers will look back and say their opinion was completely wrong or they missed something vital. Look at how many people have written negative reviews about Skyrim: not many, despite the fact that nearly all the flaws I’ve pointed out have been pointed out in 10/10 reviews. You never write in isolation but within an environment of hype, expectation and so on. You also can fall into the hype while playing, not realising that there’s actually no substance – just pretty colours and sounds distracting you from the emptiness (which Skyrim did).

          Finally, not all hindsight updates will necessarily be negative. I think I would’ve originally given Deus Ex in the upper 80s in terms of review score – now that I’ve played it for ages I would give it a near perfect score, since I’ve finally seen all the dynamics involved.

          There’s nothing wrong with changing your mind due to time and evidence. It’s how we make our best decisions (and its one of the properties of scientific investigation). I’ve changed my mind on some things and I wouldn’t want to be represented by old things I’ve written, if I don’t view it that way anymore. You surely don’t hold all the same views on things that you did when you were 12.

    • http://twitter.com/tauriqmoosa Tauriq Moosa

      Great idea.

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  • bob bob

    What a brilliant write up. It’s refreshing to see someone write about Skyrim and not look like a paid commercial for it at the same time. Everything you wrote is spot on in its accuracy. 

    • http://twitter.com/tauriqmoosa Tauriq Moosa

      Thank you very much!

  • Anonymous

    I’ve completed the main quest line and haven’t returned to the title, can’t bring myself around to it, instead I find myself shooting up people in BF3 to see what i can unlock

    • http://twitter.com/tauriqmoosa Tauriq Moosa

      Wish I had BF3.

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  • Captainhu

    Here’s the problem.  No one who has played the game and loved it gives a shit about anything you said.  Your complaints are really nonsensical when the worst things you can come  up with simply don’t matter to the VAST majority of those playing the game.  It’s not Bethesda’s faults more than it is your own personal issues on display here.  Millions of people CAN be wrong, but you’ll have a helluva time proving that.

    • http://twitter.com/tauriqmoosa Tauriq Moosa

      Firstly, take a breath. It’s a game. Swearing is unnecessary to make your point. We’re not solving global hunger, we’re talking about fighting dragons with magic spells.

      Secondly, many of those people who played this game and loved it, even going so far as to give it a game of year award, DO agree with me. As you can read from many of the comments, including from one the editors who did give that award, they regret it and agree with my complaints. They might not dislike it as much as me, but you’d have to show me where my arguments are wrong before simply asserting that I just AM wrong.

      If I didn’t change your mind and you love this game, great. My problem isn’t with people who enjoyed the game – it’s the failure to fix problems that have consistently been with Bethesda games. I’m not sure which part, but I’d be willing to revise my view if I am wrong.

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  • Herve

    again one review to have more clicks… And asking the developers to ask for fan’s help is really not a good idea. Go to any forum about games and you will have hundreds of people saying that they have an idea to improve the game (any game) the forum is about, only the 100 people all have different ideas. And when the devs follow one of them, they either say that they have been ripped of their own idea, or forgot about it and have other ideas.

    • http://twitter.com/tauriqmoosa Tauriq Moosa

      “again one review to have more clicks”

      Oh! I can play this. “Again, one more comment to vent on the internet.”

      “And asking the developers to ask for fan’s help is really not a good idea.”Naughty Dog is one example I thought did really well. Your assessment of how to go about involving gamers seems a little bit short-sighted given that gamers are ALSO developers themselves; and your way can apply regardless of whether you’re talking about gamers or not. But more importantly, I don’t see what’s wrong with my little competition idea. I don’t think its brilliant, but it doesn’t fail on the account you gave since it’s no different to other short-story competitions – the prize though sounds great: your own story in the game and a copy of the game. You provide one bad example of how to go about enlisting gamers as though that’s the only way to do so. I agree that it would be horrible to do so in that way, but there are more effective mechanisms.

  • Jbjakebianco9

    To be perfectly honest, i agree with most of the criticisms here. But they in no way are they game-breaking for me. I have logged over 150 hours on it, and I can easily say it is my all-time fav game purchase. Sure it has its faults, but every game does. I dunno, maybe I’m just tired of the pointless games that havecome out over the last few years. To me, Skyrim is a much-needed break from on-the-rail shooters with tiny maps and the same guns given a new makeover each year. (Bf 3 broke the mould a bit, thankfully)

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