The new consoles have ushered in some great fidelity, and some amazing games – but so few of them hit that magical 1080p/60fps target that was supposed to define this gen. Ever wondered why that is?
Well, according to the chaps behind the Nitrous engine (which powers the first commercially available DX12 game) it’s all down to maths. Naturally, I understand close to nothing of what the Nitrous team says then.
“It’s simple math. Last generation consoles and this generation, I think the number I heard quoted was it was 6 times more powerful. That’s great, right? Then you do the math. You realize that if you’re running at 720p and going to 1080p you’ve doubled the number of pixels.
“If you were running 30 frames a second at 720 and you doubled your pixels and wanted to double your frame rate, you just used 4 more per and you have no more perf. Then you additionally want to increase the fidelity. You’ll see the same thing on 4K. It has 4 times the pixels as 1080. You need a GPU 4 times as powerful just to do the same thing you did before just at a higher resolution level with most engines. With Nitrous you actually don’t. That’s probably why you haven’t seen the big jump that some people were expecting.”
Not enough number for you? Here’s more. And while yes, the new consoles would be able to run games at 1080p and 60fps, there are a great many concessions that would have to be made.
“It also takes increased bandwidth, etc. etc. When you try to get a game down into the 16 milliseconds consistently, category, it’s amazing how those milliseconds add up. Going to 30 frames per second is like gaining those extra milliseconds really is huge in terms of flexibility you’ve got there. It’s very difficult. Every game generation you want to do something a little more ambitious.
“And to pack additional graphics plus additional AI, plus additional gameplay and everything else into 16 milliseconds can be really, really challenging. Especially when trying to do that consistently. The last thing you want to do is stutter between 60 frames per second and 30. You don’t want to jump back and forth there a whole lot. There’s a lot of people that will argue the development cost and the discipline it takes to make a game run consistently at 16 milliseconds is just very difficult to achieve.”
I think the gist of it is that the new consoles just aren’t powerful enough – but that’s something we know already. IT’s also very heavily dependent on the engine – and as we’ve seen in things like The Fox Engine, it is possible to make a game that runs at 1080p and 60fps – and looks great to boot.
Just don’t expect that as the standard. At least not this generation.
Last Updated: December 15, 2015
Ottokie
December 15, 2015 at 12:03
My FPS is capped at 120… o wait consoles. Never mind
*runs* (smoothly)
Spy Master Tokashi
December 15, 2015 at 12:07
It is so awesome that you can cap your FPS, I mean what are you going to do with all those extra faps per second …
Ottokie
December 15, 2015 at 12:08
Anything over that and the GPU go’s “let me sing you the song of my people!”
Captain JJ 4x
December 15, 2015 at 12:09
Mine doesn’t sing, but I think it’s “people” are all from hell, because it just starts setting fire to everything that comes near it.
RinceThis
December 15, 2015 at 12:30
lol
WitWolfy
December 15, 2015 at 12:18
Too bad that most games released this year cant say the same…
Sageville
December 15, 2015 at 13:26
*Plays Batman – Arkha…. nvm
WitWolfy
December 15, 2015 at 12:06
Optimization, dev tools, proper coding and talent. Thats whats missing.
lordjhb22
December 15, 2015 at 13:22
How dare you say such sensible thing??!!
geel slang
December 18, 2015 at 17:54
I love how people always blame the devs, they are lazy, have no talent, no passion. Yea, you believe that if it makes you happy.
TwinStripeUK
December 18, 2015 at 18:36
Then how come some devs can do it and others can’t?
MONKEY.D LUFFY
December 30, 2015 at 21:57
hardware limitation =console 😛
TwinStripeUK
December 30, 2015 at 22:45
Read my question and then read your answer.
On second thoughts, get an adult to read it to you, I don’t want to be accused of unnecessary cruelty…
MONKEY.D LUFFY
December 30, 2015 at 23:18
LOL (???) zzz
WitWolfy
December 31, 2015 at 17:47
Damn, you know you are right. How dare I point out the obvious factors. The proboem lay by us demanding gamers who pay R900 for broken games. Grrrrr damn them…
Ryanza
December 15, 2015 at 12:09
Why do consoles struggle to hit 1080p 60fps? Shit cheap low end gfx and shit cheap low end cpu. 1.6ghz cpu. What’s that a fucking shitty laptop.
And more people are buying into that bullshit and that’s why my 6 year old pc cpu and gfx is still playing video games at max resolution and high fps.
Console gaming. Two peas in a fucking pot.
Ottokie
December 15, 2015 at 12:11
http://img.pandawhale.com/post-66066-nervous-black-boy-cat-combined-7UwM.gif
Ryanza
December 15, 2015 at 12:16
https://dn3pm25xmtlyu.cloudfront.net/photos/large/821618913.png?1384395719&Expires=1450260718&Signature=KIVGVw5Fzv5ZuZHhT-LoYuJ6HLJA2UGlguZNPt55vhZdxKikBDucDHXxhlYxY03AYurrISM-jB81llFNqB2POzdH-CQKiRGWBS8M0fb7PxyX99cPA5SDwKmWCyM-tPIi-PoOFC6UGbG352ROb7Q5-w3W3E2vszN9ewb21lvXXYM_&Key-Pair-Id=APKAIYVGSUJFNRFZBBTA
RinceThis
December 15, 2015 at 12:30
Hahaha
Pieter
December 15, 2015 at 12:12
Stay off the chems.
Captain JJ 4x
December 15, 2015 at 12:13
This is really the wrong crowd to be commenting here today, but alas, I will defend the console (as a pc gamer).
It’s not about being as strong as a high-end pc, or a five year old one. It’s about offering affordability and ease of use to a larger market that doesn’t have interest (or knowledge) of hardware. As much as I like to diss the consoles, I can respect what they are and where their place is in the market.
You can’t expect them to be where pc’s are, because pc’s are ever changing…and customisable.
I don’t even think comparing the two is viable anymore these days.
Ottokie
December 15, 2015 at 12:17
Yea consoles are a whole different way of “gaming”, even I am picking up a PS4 this Christmas.
And I get kicked in the balls a lot for playing the “master race” card. But I just have a dry humor, so you are welcome to trash talk me back xD
The Grand Admiral Chief
December 15, 2015 at 12:17
Guess who is not getting a revive…
miaau
December 15, 2015 at 12:19
that is just plain mean…..
Just because he loves both PS4 and PC? tsk tsk.
Is there another, more serious reason, for the lack of revive, perhaps? Hmm?
The Grand Admiral Chief
December 15, 2015 at 12:20
He likes pink
Ottokie
December 15, 2015 at 12:21
https://hostr.co/files/E6rTM6D/oh-stop-it-you_large.jpg
Captain JJ 4x
December 15, 2015 at 12:22
We’ve already established that he’s man enough to do pink.
Your aversion to it speaks volumes though 😉
The Grand Admiral Chief
December 15, 2015 at 12:23
Never ONCE did I say I’m against it. So get your facts straight Lenny
Captain JJ 4x
December 15, 2015 at 12:30
You are implying though that there’s something wrong about Ottokie liking it. 😉
And Lenny speaks hard truths! …before carefully laying low until things calm down again.
RinceThis
December 15, 2015 at 12:32
XD
miaau
December 15, 2015 at 12:25
ah, well. there you go.
I hate pink because when my little girl was born, all these people wanted to give pink stuff. WHY??????? So I purposefully did things like buy blue decorations and balloons when we celebrated her baptism. Got some stick from the in laws, but hey. was not pink.
The Grand Admiral Chief
December 15, 2015 at 12:27
Hehehe, my daughter upgraded to purple about a year or so ago 🙂
miaau
December 15, 2015 at 12:33
I will try, when she gets a little older…… Right now, she does not care about such things as pink and blue and red, she just likes various toys and balls, with a wide spectrum of colour.
Captain JJ 4x
December 15, 2015 at 12:19
I have a PS3. Good blu ray player indeed.
I’m still trying to get around Steam Machines. I can think having a low-end one could be nice and compact for travel, but ones that are in line with my pc just don’t make sense to me. My pc can do everything and more than it can.
Ottokie
December 15, 2015 at 12:22
I have all consoles, just not the current gens 😛
My gaming life started on console waaaaay back when xD
Captain JJ 4x
December 15, 2015 at 12:23
I started on pc, then got a PS1, then back to pc (skipped PS2), then PS3 while still on pc (which never saw much use). Now I’m grown up, so I can only have one. I picked pc. 🙂
Ottokie
December 15, 2015 at 12:24
I grew up on a farm, my first internet I got only in 2011, then I switched over to PC mainly
Captain JJ 4x
December 15, 2015 at 12:28
Ah. Fair enough.
I also only got internet at home myself about six years ago, and then Steam swallowed me.
Alien Emperor Trevor
December 15, 2015 at 12:38
Why would I trash talk you for buying a PS4? I don’t even know you.
Ottokie
December 15, 2015 at 12:41
You cut me deep man 🙁
Alien Emperor Trevor
December 15, 2015 at 12:41
😀
Ottokie
December 15, 2015 at 12:41
I have to get a PS4, that’s where all the good JRPG’s are hiding in 2016 😛
Alien Emperor Trevor
December 15, 2015 at 12:47
I kinda wish PC got a few decent new ones.
Ottokie
December 15, 2015 at 12:48
^ This
Captain JJ 4x
December 15, 2015 at 12:49
There are about 30 vanilla RPG-maker JRPGs on Steam for around $5 each. I hear some of them have storylines. 😉
Alien Emperor Trevor
December 15, 2015 at 12:52
Oh I’ve seen those. Not really interested in Greenlight trash.
Captain JJ 4x
December 15, 2015 at 12:54
I respect the idea behind it, but when they’re using vanilla RPG-maker textures and characters then you lose my interest. You can draw/ download/ make your own textures and import them. It’s not that hard, I’ve tried.
There’s some good stuff on Greenlight, but there’s some….uhm…not so good stuff either.
Alien Emperor Trevor
December 15, 2015 at 12:56
Greenlight is like old-timey gold mining. I don’t have the patience to sift through it all to find one or two nuggets of gold.
Captain JJ 4x
December 15, 2015 at 12:57
I agree. Completely, I just every once in a while stumble upon one when I’m browsing.
miaau
December 15, 2015 at 13:36
Yes. you might just find a nugget of purest green. And then were would you be?
RinceThis
December 15, 2015 at 12:51
So your on his ‘people’ list?
Ottokie
December 15, 2015 at 12:53
xD
Alien Emperor Trevor
December 15, 2015 at 12:57
Guess who’s not on my people list? YOU. Because you’re not a real boy. Even oVg is on my PC – sure, as a Kubrow, but that still counts.
RinceThis
December 15, 2015 at 12:59
He’s in hibernation! I’d rather be a bot!
Alien Emperor Trevor
December 15, 2015 at 13:01
Of COURSE he’s in hibernation. Do you think I’d let him wander around unsupervised?
Ottokie
December 15, 2015 at 13:05
https://45.media.tumblr.com/b3dad494aeed8828cc69bc4714a4c837/tumblr_mp47dteRTM1rq794ko1_400.gif
Alien Emperor Trevor
December 15, 2015 at 13:05
That, or he’d trying humping my operator.
Ottokie
December 15, 2015 at 13:06
Huehueheu, that sneaky spoiler
RinceThis
December 15, 2015 at 13:07
So you saw him last week? 0_O
Ottokie
December 15, 2015 at 13:08
Nope, that is only an interpretation of what I think he looks like xD
Ryanza
December 15, 2015 at 12:23
It’s about progression yo. If majority of gamers are on consoles then consoles need to progress faster.
PS3 good fucking cpu. PS4 cpu worse than PS3 cpu. Progression. PS4 with that PS3 cpu and they could have used the money they wasted on that shitty PS4 cpu to add a better gfx with that 8gig ram. Progression.
Captain JJ 4x
December 15, 2015 at 12:27
I agree.
It’s holding back some progression for sure, but look at the indie and early access games on Steam though. Luckily I’m not too fussed with “AAA” or not, and 80% of my favourite games are not that amazing on graphics either.
The indie games though are setting new standards and even “AAA” games are starting to take lessons from them. The last three years on console lifespans are slow though in the gaming industry, but at least we have Steam 🙂
Ryanza
December 15, 2015 at 12:29
Steam? what is that?
Don’t Support DRM. Cyberpunk 2077 is coming.
Captain JJ 4x
December 15, 2015 at 12:33
I like Steam. It does what I need it to. I’ve never had serious problems and the little ones that there were, well, you know, nothing is perfect.
Also. I have Witcher 3 on GOG and Steam….and I prefer it on Steam because it just works so much better.
I am excited about Cyberpunk though.
RinceThis
December 15, 2015 at 12:33
Steam? It’s all a load of hot air 0_O
Ryanza
December 15, 2015 at 12:36
Isn’t hot air what your pc game product become after Steam gets involved.
RinceThis
December 15, 2015 at 12:51
0_O
HvR
December 15, 2015 at 12:33
Only thing is affordability was left in the sea.
Captain JJ 4x
December 15, 2015 at 12:35
Yea. That’s very true.
PC has gotten way cheaper as time has passed. I suppose for most they’d prefer something that will guarantee them not to have any compatibility issues, and something they don’t need to service themselves.
miaau
December 15, 2015 at 12:23
I am a console gamer. I like it. It is simple and easy for me to do. I want no hassles.
Also, please look at games on the Xbox 360, like Skyrim. Then look at the amount of RAM on the Xbox 360. How on earth did they get a game like that to even play?
They wrote the OS as tight as possible, for the hardware and gave direct access as needed. There is nothing wrong with this. Your laptop has a “generic” os, not stricly optimised for EVERY single piece of hardware, not just the main bits like CPU, RAM and GPU, but all the little bridges, IO’s and controllers as well.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xbox_360_technical_specifications
Ryanza
December 15, 2015 at 12:25
It’s 2015. As a console gamer you deserve better consoles than what you have now.
miaau
December 15, 2015 at 12:30
For what I paid, it does the job superbly well of DVD player, home entertainment, youtube watcher, music streamer and all that. AND I can play killer games like Witcher 3 and fallout 4. And Monopoly, it seems, as well. All from my TV room couches. Easy to use. (Yes, I know a computer next to the TV with remote mouse can do all that and more. But it is not the same at all.)
ALL in one device. Yes, I think they could have done better with the hardware, been a little more beefy, but the balance with price is important as well. I, for example, would not have R10 000 for it. Just would not consider it worth that amount. Also note the hardware in the PS3/4 Xbox 1/360 has to be of a very high standard, as these devices spend a lot of time on. (trying to say that is needs quality build and hardware, which also adds to the cost)
Ryanza
December 15, 2015 at 12:32
For R7000 you should have gotten much better hardware. But this generation is about profits for Sony and Microsoft, in other words, shitty old hardware.
miaau
December 15, 2015 at 12:39
It would seem that they made very little on each unit, as manufacture cost was very close to to selling price when they came out, as a per a quick google search.
and of course it is about profit. I get that, I am also about profit. I want systems at any company I work at to make money, as does MS and Sony.
I fail to see how inferior systems would still be selling this well 2 years after launch
Captain JJ 4x
December 15, 2015 at 12:48
Without profit why should Sony and MS even bother? And then of course it goes about profitability in competition with one another, because if one starts to fall behind it means potentially going under.
They need to try and fit a budget with a price with a product…whilst remaining competitive.
Ryanza
December 15, 2015 at 13:03
Consoles are known for not making money. And they make their money back through selling games.
Consoles uselessly take years before seeing any profits. Microsoft makes so much money that console debt is nothing to them. Sony was the same for years, only now their other revenues are turning to shit.
If you want sustainability as a console maker, making profits from selling consoles, you look at Nintendo. The Wii U plus one game = profit from get go.
So if you look at what Nintendo has been offering over the years compared to what Microsoft and Sony has been offering. Then people always ask why Nintendo consoles also have to be so shit. Sustainability. And Microsoft and Sony consoles have been debt holes. But PS4 and Xbox One is different, if you look at the hardware.
I would still like to have had PS4 and Xbox One being a massive debt hole for Microsoft and Sony because fuck Microsoft and Sony. I want an amazingly powerful console.
miaau
December 15, 2015 at 13:07
I have my opinion and you have yours, right?
I also want an amazingly powerful console, but I fail to see how one can be made for a price tag that people will be willing to pay for. So I get what made sense to me.
Captain JJ 4x
December 15, 2015 at 13:13
I work in pricing, licensing and product implementation.
It doesn’t work like you think it does.
Ryanza
December 15, 2015 at 13:15
You do know that your bubble doesn’t really apply to all other bubbles.
Captain JJ 4x
December 15, 2015 at 13:16
Oh wow. You really have no idea.
I’m out.
Greylingad[CNFRMD]
December 15, 2015 at 13:17
HAHAHAHA!!! Yep, this^^
Ir0nseraph
December 15, 2015 at 13:17
XD
Ryanza
December 15, 2015 at 13:20
I get what you trying to say. Don’t assume I don’t get it. It’s easy to just play the, oh you just stupid, card.
When it concerns Ryanza you should it assume he gets it all. Don’t just put a frame around a few words on a screen.
miaau
December 15, 2015 at 13:44
interesting. I make new products and enhance existing ones. Well, have them made. Ok, design them and watch other people implement that. And then other people still to make. Yeah, do not like work with my hands.
But that is interesting to say the least. It is very, very difficult to get that right, licensing and pricing thereof. Fun stuff. tempted to study something in that line next year.
JHN
December 15, 2015 at 12:50
Gaming is a business, of coarse its about profits, if it wasn’t we wouldn’t get great games because there was no money to be made.
Ryanza
December 15, 2015 at 13:04
If consoles were about profits then you would be getting Wii and Wii U consoles from Microsoft and Sony.
JHN
December 15, 2015 at 13:07
Lets agree to disagree.
Ryanza
December 15, 2015 at 13:13
No. I am right. I am always right. Only that one time I thought I was wrong.
I’ve been following consoles and numbers for a long time. I know what I am talking about. I’m not just trying to make a, business = profits type comment.
JHN
December 15, 2015 at 13:17
I respect your view and knowledge, but I know enough about retail to understand the console business model. I also own one of the consoles and am extremely happy with it, regardless of its sub par hardware.
Ryanza
December 15, 2015 at 13:27
You shouldn’t respect my views and knowledge. Most of the time it’s not my views, just a view, with some stupidness. I don’t really bring knowledge nor proper logic. I leave that to the people who like to google for their logic.
WitWolfy
December 15, 2015 at 12:49
Here, here… Just wish Sony would start catering towards “the players”… Their console is starting to feel more communistic with each passing day.
Want PS3 BC??? Too bad!! You cant get it!!! Here, buy this “remaster”. Or heck try PS NOW if your bandwidth can sustain it!
Want PS2 BC??? Wait, what, you still have your original PS2 discs??? Too bad “The PS4 cant read DVD’s” so you have to rebuy all those games AGAIN if you REALLY wanna play them so bad!
Sony is slowly starting to become Microsoft, and Microsoft is slowly starting to become Sony…
miaau
December 15, 2015 at 13:05
I have said for ages that most the critisim the internet used to level at Microsoft Windows should now be levelled at Android, as Android is doing a lot of what MS USED to do.
Evolution in motion, as we watch. Also, Moores Law of computing, that also changed massively in the last few years, with computers being useful for far longer periods than even just a decade ago.
RinceThis
December 15, 2015 at 12:31
http://gifsec.com/wp-content/uploads/GIF/2014/04/unsure-gif.gif?gs=a
Ryanza
December 15, 2015 at 13:17
No likes for this comment. I love it. Takes me back to the old days.
miaau
December 15, 2015 at 12:11
I know the answer.
It is because they were designed to. Bdddm -tssssssssshhh
The Grand Admiral Chief
December 15, 2015 at 12:17
HANDSOME AVATAR-MAN
RinceThis
December 15, 2015 at 12:29
perf? perf? nerf.
Generic ZA
December 15, 2015 at 13:12
60 fps, but there’s more than 60 Fresh Peas Served in that header pic. ;P
Corrie
December 15, 2015 at 13:16
Because it uses inferior hardware and it’s soul purpose is to suck it’s consumers dry with coporate greed and because you know
It’s playing Ketchup
#PCMustardRace
HisDivineOrder
December 16, 2015 at 04:42
The PS4 and Xbox One are based around netbook-class CPU’s with relatively low-end GPU’s. 1080p60 was always going to be a stretch for them if they wanted 1080p.
The more interesting thing to consider is that VR (such as PSVR on PS4) requires AT LEAST 60fps to prevent nausea. And the more framerate, the better. And it displays not one image, but two (one for each eye). At 1080p per eye.
Imagine how great those PS4 games running 1080p (x2) at 60+ fps are going to look in fidelity with all the “concessions” they’ll have to implement to get there.
Joshua Paul
January 4, 2016 at 04:07
Once you peek 144 frames on PC, going down to 30fps is madness! If I was on tight income, older games would be my choice simply because they will run at higher frame rate. Like it or not–Frame rates will define game play functionality!